****Are you turning this thread into being about you and what you went through as a victim of abuse?****
Tell me the "correct" answer to your question because I don't understand what your motivation is for asking since my children and I have never benefitted in any way, shape or form from being victims of domestic violence crimes in the United States of America...including financially...just because I've written on this discussion forum about it.
As far as I am concerned, Mncowgirl is "venting" about the "injustice" of being a VICTIM of another PERSON'S Criminal CHOICES that has and CONTINUES to be a financial HARDSHIP for HER and all others who are negatively impacted by Ms. Tuttle's stealing money from HER.
Even as I write this...MORE MONEY has been spent for and on behalf of Ms. Tuttle, regardless of what the U.S. Judicial System does to hold her "accountable" for the crimes she was charged with.
How much MONEY has been spent and provided for on behalf of mncowgirl by ANYONE in the U.S. to ensure the American Dream mncowgirl was pursing prior to Ms. Tuttle's illegal choice to STEAL that hard earned money from her?
The difference is mncowgirl worked and earned U.S. Money with respect, not deceit...yet...mncowgirl is now the LAST on the LIST of being respected or supported for what she was doing to pursue the American Dream in Honesty so that she and others closest to her wouldn't NEED anyone else's money to survive.
Mncowgirl earned and worked for her money/success in HONESTY and RESPECT of the American Dream and Ms. Tuttle destroyed that...NOT mncowgirl.
Yet, 99% of U.S. Citizen's are going to allow their local, state and federal U.S. Government to "tap" them out financially with taxes and pay for Ms. Tuttle's "rights" as a criminal defendant in the U.S.
What's left for mncowgirl even though she didn't commit any crimes...???
ZERO!!!
You and so many just don't get it that "real victims of crimes" are the LAST on the LIST to be respresented or receive restitution for a crime (s) committed against them.
I understand and appreciate that there are real victims of crime. I have known many of them, and have been one of them. My point is that you said that mncowgirl made this thread about her, when you seem to do the same in quite a few threads, whether or not you started them. You have a tendency to make things about your struggle, and it was hypocritical of you to make that comment about mncowgirl.
Are you the pot or the kettle?
-------------- PEZ the only candy you eat after your favorite fictional character spits it out of their tracheotomy hole.
This is my real name · Posted on Sep. 02 2011,8:11 pm
***I understand and appreciate that there are real victims of crime. I have known many of them, and have been one of them. ***
If you understand and empthasize with victims of crimes...I applaud you!
****My point is that you said that mncowgirl made this thread about her, when you seem to do the same in quite a few threads, whether or not you started them. You have a tendency to make things about your struggle, and it was hypocritical of you to make that comment about mncowgirl.****
I don't know what your intention is with this accusation that you are implying about me.
Not ONCE did I write or imply that I am "judging" mncowgirl in any way, shape or form for starting this thread.
I also have NOT accused mncowgirl in any way, shape or form of being "wrong" for writing about how she has been negatively impacted by the crimes committed by Tuttle and her disappointment in the judicial outcome of Tuttle's sentencing in this thread.
***Are you the pot or the kettle? ***
I guess that's up to you to decide...not me...After all, it's YOU who is claiming to have full disclosure and knowledge of my thoughts and choices about what and why I write what I do on here...
As far as I am concerned, Mncowgirl is "venting" about the "injustice" of being a VICTIM of another PERSON'S Criminal CHOICES that has and CONTINUES to be a financial HARDSHIP for HER and all others who are negatively impacted by Ms. Tuttle's stealing money from HER.
Even as I write this...MORE MONEY has been spent for and on behalf of Ms. Tuttle, regardless of what the U.S. Judicial System does to hold her "accountable" for the crimes she was charged with.
So what's your solution? From what you write, locking her up and throwing away the key would still result in more money being spent on her than her victim. Or merely letting her go would be a travesty of justice and only advancing your theory that victims are ignored.
So I'm curious how you would serve "justice" in this case?
-------------- "Here is something for those who think I have not done much on my own to think about. I must then be one of the luckiest people around, and I think I am, I should then be able to keep that same luck going for the benefit of our area." - New ALEDA Executive Director Dan Dorman.
BB, with a title of "OMG tuttle only got 42 months, I see it more about her.
Yea...that makes sense also.
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At what point do you start making it more about victims rights and less about the accused? How can it be done.
I'm not stating that U.S. Due Process needs to be more about victims than an accused rights.
I simply believe victims aren't considered and respected enough by the U.S. Judicial System and Society as in the past.
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Defense lawyers have free reign.
Actually, based upon personal experience and research on U.S. State Prosecutor's, Judges, Criminal Defense Attorney's and Sentencing Guidelines Committes/Commisions; EACH and EVERYONE is included in your "free reign" theory.
Sorry...
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Our country is partially founded on the rights of the accused, you know, innocent until found guilty.
Yea, I'm very aware of this.
I'm also very aware at how well the innocent until found guilty as it applies to an HONEST ACCUSED DEFENDANT in this country is being destroyed by the HONESTLY GUILTY who get to enjoy the privileges of INNOCENCE through a plea bargain agreement.
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But once a person is found guilty, things need to change to give the guilty what society deems a punishment, not how much can the defense drudge this out to make the excuses why this person did the crime to lessen the punishment.
Exactly!!!
And, once again, the fault is not exclusively owned by "defense attorney's."
We also have to look at U.S. State Prosecutor's, Judges and Sentencing Guidelines Commisions for playing their role in this and also at U.S. Society's eager acceptance of "excusable crimes."
Certainly our country was once about WHO is HONESTLY innocent until proven guilty, yet who is innocent and who is guilty has turned into a very 'gray area' with little empasis on defining the distinct differences that exist between what is legal vs illegal/right vs wrong/good vs evil, moral vs immoral, accountable vs unaccountable, human error vs intention harm, ect...
Not too many people care to KNOW or akcknowledge what it is like to take one single step in the shoes of a U.S. Citizen who has suffered WRONGFULL hardship created and caused by another U.S. Citizen.
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'Anyway, back to the topic. Bias or not, I think the unc put it as it is.
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I know this isn't going to help, but, she was only brought up on one count of wire fraud...thus she got just about sentenced for one count if your 5 years per count is right. I know it isn't right, but, that's the court judgement for you!
So what's your solution? From what you write, locking her up and throwing away the key would still result in more money being spent on her than her victim. Or merely letting her go would be a travesty of justice and only advancing your theory that victims are ignored.
So I'm curious how you would serve "justice" in this case?
Maybe they should let her try her luck. Throw the dice, double or nothing.
-------------- Actually my wife is especially happy when my google check arrives each month. Thanks to douchbags like you, I get paid just for getting you worked up. -Liberal
So what's your solution? From what you write, locking her up and throwing away the key would still result in more money being spent on her than her victim. Or merely letting her go would be a travesty of justice and only advancing your theory that victims are ignored.
So I'm curious how you would serve "justice" in this case?
Maybe they should let her try her luck. Throw the dice, double or nothing.
Careful maddog, with her being on that there medication that induces the urge to gamble and stymie any and all self control not to gamble could be construed as giving crack to a recovering crack addict.
The meds made me do it, WOW what a defense
-------------- *SIC SEMPER TYRANNIS / MOLON LABE / Se Defendendo memoria of cado frater ,Semper fidelis *The object of war is NOT to DIE for YOUR Country, but to make the OTHER BASTARD DIE for HIS...Patton My Constitutional Rights trump your dead.
I don't visit or post on this site very often anymore...so, I apologize for the delay in my getting back to you.
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So what's your solution?
I don't have any solutions and I've never claimed that I do. All I have to offer is my thoughts, ideas, experiences and opinions that you can read at YOUR OWN RISK.
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From what you write, locking her up and throwing away the key would still result in more money being spent on her than her victim.
I didn't write that I wanted Tuttle locked up and the key to her release thrown away.
As far as I am concerned, Tuttle only spent MORE at the expense of her victims, U.S.Tax payers and the Judicial Systems TIME and MONEY when she pleaded NOT GUILTY to ALL the CRIMINAL CHARGES against her.
For over a year...all TIME and MONEY spent was on behalf of Tuttle's U.S. Due Process RIGHTS because SHE CHOOSE to play the "INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY BEYOND a REASONABLE DOUBT card.
Tuttle threw in her TRUMP card, yet when push came to shove...she folded and refused to play her hand.
She was bluffing...yet, she still got paid and walked away from her gambling with the U.S. Judicial System better off than her opponents...her victims and U.S. Taxpayers.
enough on herself and her defense at the expense and time of taxpayers and the just tired of the U.S. criminal defendants, such as Tuttle who plea to being "NOT GUILTY" to all charges against them only to later plea bargain to being "GUILTY" of something related to what they were charged with.
Now, Tuttle can gamble with NOT having to pay any resitution to her victims because she is incarerated and as an undermployed/self-employed criminal defendant on probation for as long as she has to avoid ever giving a dime to her real victims.
Why?
Because Tuttle will always see herself as the REAL VICTIM of circumstances beyond her control. We really can't expect someone who claims to have NO KNOWLEDGE of the difference between RIGHT and WRONG because she was taking medication perscribed by a Dr..
Tuttle can claim she's SORRY and REGRETS what she's done to her VICTIMS...but until she CHOOSES to make her life about PAYING them back for HER POOR CHOICES...I don't care what she WRITES to the A.L. Tribune to apologize.
Sorry's are good. Change is always BETTER.
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Or merely letting her go would be a travesty of justice and only advancing your theory that victims are ignored.
Victims are ONLY IGNORED because NOT ENOUGH people CARE about INDIVIDUAL U.S. VICTIMS OF Crime (s) committed by another U.S. Citizen (s).
Look at the Humane Society...
People donated to them without question because poor little "puppy" and "kitty" NEED to be taken care and how dare Tuttle take even ONE PENNY from DEFENSELESS ANIMALS and their FUTURE HOME and SECURITY in the COMMUNITY.
So, how many of the community members made a meal or donated MONEY to PEOPLE and their FAMILIES of the COMMUNITY who lost MONEY and SECURITY for their FUTURE because Tuttle STOLE from them as she did from the DEFENSELESS ANIMALS of the HUMANE SOCIETY?
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So I'm curious how you would serve "justice" in this case?
Justice?
How is that possible when 99% of the people depend on the Judicial System to take care of and deliver "justice" to victims of crimes instead of caring enough to know if it's a FACT that it actually gets accomplished?
If after 10 years, will YOU or anyone else care if mncowgirl recieved her restituion (monetary payback) from Tuttle???
Maybe we should start requiring that U.S. Criminal Defendant's who plea NOT GUILTY not be released to live freely in our communities as ifthey are innocent until proven guilty if the best they can give is a plea bargain to being GUILTY for reduced charges and dismissmals of charges LATER instead.
Maybe we should require that every U.S. Defendant who pleas to not being guilty of any criminal charges filed against them, has to follow through with facing their victims/accusers and challenge the evidence gathered against them based upon DUE PROCESS at a trial by jury or judge?
I wish I could "fix" and had the "solutions" to this issue...
