|
|
| Post Number: 21
|
KODIAK 
Group: Members
Posts: 57
Joined: Aug. 2003
|
 |
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,4:05 pm |
|
   |
CPU, thanks for the history lesson, boy I sure didn't know those facts, thank you so much! Lets see, the U.S. intervened only after the attack on Pearl Harbor....hmmmmm.....got it. And could you give us lacking in history something more?, maybe about the Civil War?, bucause we "might be doomed to repeat it." You are so much smarter than anyone else, especially when you run off on tangents. What the hell are you talking about? You print a quote and then run off in some silly direction on your own interpretation of what it means? Pretty savvy, you could be an editor of the A.L. paper using that logic. It's Monday morning quarterbacks like you that love to hear themselves on the radio.
--------------
"Dyin ain't much of a living.....boy" Clint (Outlaw Josie Wales)
|
 |
|
|
| Post Number: 22
|
KODIAK
Group: Members
Posts: 57
Joined: Aug. 2003
|
|
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,4:10 pm |
|
 |
Since it is Monday afternoon, and not morning, your quote from Cato is wrong.
--------------
"Dyin ain't much of a living.....boy" Clint (Outlaw Josie Wales)
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 23
|
cpu_slave
Group: Members
Posts: 297
Joined: Aug. 2003
|
|
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,4:27 pm |
|
|
Listen, you are the one who stated in so many words that we attacked Hitler because of his genocide, but when I show you how that is not the case somehow I am the bad guy for pointing it out? Gee, Kodiak, tell us again how WWII was simply a humanitarian mission to save the poor jews! I guess you are also going to tell me how the civil war was just about the freedom of slaves! Look, if you think that I misinterpreted something you said then say it, but I read and re-read what you posted and still only can come to one way to take it.
Look, you can try to rip on me all you want, but the fact is that you obviously do not like to be corrected. Monday morning quarterbacking has nothing on the Rush Limbaugh-esque views of events that you seem to embrace. I get it now, if someone points out a mistake made by you, attack them personally. It’s discussion tactics like yours that are killing this forum!
OOOO spelling errors, that's grand! There are few in your own posts if you are starting to keep track!
--------------
An age is called Dark, not because the light fails to shine, but because people refuse to see it.-James A. Michener
Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.-Albert Einstein
Wise men learn more from fools than fools from wise men.- Marcus Cato
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 24
|
jimhanson
Group: Moderator
Posts: 8491
Joined: Aug. 2003
|
|
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,4:59 pm |
|
|
| Quote | | the world had no idea what Hitler was doing with the jews until AFTER we invaded and found the camps! We did not invade Germany on a humanitarian mission, we did so because Hitler invaded and occupied most of eastern and western Europe! |
Getting off the subject here (glad we are having a "spirited" discussion!), but two corrections on historical precedent:
Most of the major powers, plus the Vatican, were aware of the concentration and death camps well before the war. Concentration camps (not just for Jews, but for Gypsies, political prisoners, the retarded, etc.) were started in 1933. Lindbergh was aware of them during his trips to Germany in the 1930s. Krystalknacht (country-wide violence and roundup of Jews) occurred in 1939. Summer, 1941--Hitler orders the "final solution", mass executions start. Churchill knew, the Vatican knew, Roosevelt knew.
Regarding the U.S. involvement in WW II, the U.S. has a long history of isolationism--we didn't declare war on Germany even after they had invaded the rest of Europe. Even though we "loaned" old 4-stack destroyers to Britain--pretty much it was the Brits alone against the Germans until Pearl Harbor--then Germany declared war on US first.
Edited by jimhanson on Dec. 15 2003,5:34 pm
--------------
"If you want to anger a Conservative, tell him a lie. If you want to anger a LIBERAL, tell him the TRUTH!"
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 25
|
guest
Unregistered
|
|
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,5:08 pm |
|
|
looks like cpu's history lesson was just one upped
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 26
|
KODIAK
Group: Members
Posts: 57
Joined: Aug. 2003
|
|
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,5:10 pm |
|
|
CPU, sorry, it was your initial "shrub ditto-head" that got me right in the heart. We were all looking in the dictionary on that one. I just felt you were looking too hard for a windmill to attack and was going to have a little fun with you. I promise to try to keep it on the upper shelves. Thanks Jim for bringing this back to facts and intelligent dialogue.
--------------
"Dyin ain't much of a living.....boy" Clint (Outlaw Josie Wales)
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 27
|
Angel
Group: Members
Posts: 35
Joined: Sep. 2003
|
|
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,5:26 pm |
|
|
Goodyear Pimp
"All the invasion of Iraq was? Simple, payback to the big campaign donors by way of lucrative war contracts."
I disagree. Iraq was given an ultimatium by the UN. Saddam did not fully comply with it. That is why there was an invasion of Iraq.
I see no hurry for a trial either, Slave. But I'd bet shrub will want Saddam tried, convicted and dead before the next presidential election
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 28
|
jimhanson
Group: Moderator
Posts: 8491
Joined: Aug. 2003
|
|
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,5:30 pm |
|
|
I started my post after CPUslaves and before Kodiak's response--but got sidetracked before I could post it. What did I miss in the meantime? "Spelling errors"? "Cato quotes"? I've gone back to look for that text, and haven't found it.
If you meant "doomed to repeat it"--that was Santayana--George, not Carlos! 
I'm glad to see a discussion with differing points of view for a change--something that makes us all sit down and consider views that we might not get from our normal circle of contacts--or be fed to us on the nightly news. The value of this forum is in opening our own minds and educating ourselves, not others.
Edited by jimhanson on Dec. 15 2003,5:31 pm
--------------
"If you want to anger a Conservative, tell him a lie. If you want to anger a LIBERAL, tell him the TRUTH!"
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 29
|
cpu_slave
Group: Members
Posts: 297
Joined: Aug. 2003
|
|
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,5:50 pm |
|
|
I too apologize Kodiak, I guess I really get frustrated by the 'WMD's don't matter' arguments when that was the reason given for the 'we need to invade now' rhetoric. Perhaps Jim needs to get his sarcasm smile added on, it may have been helpful in this case.
Well Jim, thanks for the history clarification, I should have thought a little more about that before I posted. Yet the fact remains, we did not attack Germany simply because of the camps and as far as I am aware neither did any other county, so trying to compare Hitler and Saddam in so far as reasons for war are in this case Apples and Oranges. As for the spelling error, I had apparently misspelled 'than' with 'that' in the Cato quote in my sig line, and I have since corrected it. I too enjoy a debate, but I like to see what makes people have the opinions that they do and to challenge them to think about what they consider 'the truth'. I would like to see the third paragraph of your last quote on the top of the home page, as it is a profound statement. Just have to ask, is it yours or did you borrow it?
Angel, in this case I agree with Goodyear Pimp in so far as the reasons for this war. Iraq has not been the only country to not comply with the UN so I see this as a weak reason for war. As I have stated in the past, Israel has violated far more UN resolutions so if that is the justification needed when do we attack Israel and force regime change? This whole war stinks in my opinion, Bush was far too eager to get involved while we were still entrenched in Afghanistan. Since moments after the 9-11 attacks, the administration has been pushing to invade Iraq even before we had an idea who was really behind them. A war with Iraq was on the agendas of almost every neo-con in the administration, and that alone should send up a red flag to anyone paying attention.
As much as I hate to see it Angel, I too believe shrub will rush to kill Saddam just like he rushed into this war, and will incur the same mistakes.
--------------
An age is called Dark, not because the light fails to shine, but because people refuse to see it.-James A. Michener
Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.-Albert Einstein
Wise men learn more from fools than fools from wise men.- Marcus Cato
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 30
|
ARCHER
Group: Members
Posts: 5
Joined: Nov. 2003
|
|
Posted on: Dec. 15 2003,5:50 pm |
|
|
Goodyear Pimp,if my head is so far up my ass then I imagine that you feel that it is a waste of time to continue looking for this "PROOF" so IF there are ties noone should ever know!Aswell if the war is "payback to the big campaign donors by way of lucrative war contracts" my Question is "WHERE IS YOUR PROOF"!!!!! The Democratic Party would pay a fortune for this incredible conclusion!Hey IDIOT how do you justify your comments??
In Iraq under Saddam laws many were guilty until proven innocent! Why shouldn't he be brought to trial by his own rules!By the way cpu_slave I did show that they were NOT the same person but had similar objectives.As to you and Goodyear Pimp I personally think that you should learn what a PERSONAL OPINION is and watch your mouths so you don't show your ignorance as bad as you have today!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
