Topic: If some of the things I talk about scare you
started by: Rosalind_Swenson
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 16 2012,10:25 am
I know I usually just rant about the "evil" government, but here's another big problem that people should be thinking about. Now I don't care what anyone thinks about Dennis Kucinich politically. I don't care if he's some sort of "radical left-wing socialist" or any other type of label that the other side likes to use. Please just listen to what he says, and make up your own mind about the information. This is from a Congressional Briefing on ending Nuclear Power held last month. If you are able to dispute the information these people give, go ahead. At least listen to the information and THINK about things.
In the first video Kucinich talks about how some of our nuclear power plants are literally falling apart. He describes how and the dangers of this. He tells about how the regulators have been covering it up and downplaying the dangers. He talks about the huge government funded expense of maintaining these plants.
In the second video, Mitsuhei Murata, Japan’s former Ambassador to Switzerland talks about how insane it was to build 54 nuclear power plants in Japan which has so many earthquakes and tsunamis, and that it was only greed and lack of ethics that did this. He tells how ridiculous nuclear power plants are when nobody has any idea (still) what to do with the waste. He says that the Fukishima incident is still a big danger. If even a small earthquake Unit 4 will collapse and will be a huge catastrophe for the world. And he says (I will paraphrase) humans as a whole, are mindless lazy greedy unethical idiots with no thought of the future and are running for the edge of a cliff as quickly as they can. Arjun Makhijani, world renowned nuclear expert compares costs of solar power in Germany and here. It costs twice as much here. He talks about the vast number of nuclear power plants being shut down world wide in different parts of the world. Shut down for different reasons. He tells how Germany did a sort of test recently with their solar power and during one work day they were able to meet 1/3 of their electricity needs, and the next day (Saturday) they were able to meet 1/2 of their electric needs. He explains common sense reasons why nuclear and fossil fuels are dangerous and heading nowhere, and that renewable energy avoidance is strictly political. Mariko Bender talks about the spreading of radiation from Fukishima (if you only get news from mainstream you won't know about this. If you only believe mainstream and no other sources you won't believe some of the things she says and will just put her in the "kook" category). She tells how the "official acceptable" limit of radiation has been increased by 20 times what it had been initially. She tells how the government and doctors tell people they are safe to stay in Fukishima and it is safe for babies and children even at 100X's the initial acceptable limits. She says how doctors and scientists outside of Fukishima say that children and pregnant women need to leave. She says the food in Fukishima is contaminated with radiation but they all have to eat it. She explains that abnormal thyroid growth was found in 43% of Fukishima children since the disaster.
Third video, Arnie Gundersen-big man in nuclear power for most of his life, turned anti-nuclear power explains how full of crap the NRC is and points out different obvious lies they have told. He explains how much keeping nuclear going costs taxpayers. His speech is way too short for some reason. Just google and see some of the things he has been trying to bring attention to with several plants in the US. Paul Gunter- Nuclear watchdog who has publicly busted some major badness in the nuclear power industry, he says how dangerous some of the reactors are and that even when they were built back in the 70's the government watchdog of atomic energy even voiced concerns and told the government and nuclear people that they were not safe. (The same flawed reactor he's talking about, the same one at Fukishima is also the one used in Monticello MN)
< http://coalitionagainstnukes.org/ai1ec_e..._id=266 >
---------------------
So far I've only made it ten minutes into the third video, but I don't have time to finish right now. Maybe some of you want to watch all four when you have the time. I am not trying to scare people, I just want people to wake up to some very major problems we face. For our childrens' sakes.
Posted by Botto 82 on Oct. 16 2012,12:21 pm
As I've said before, Humanity's biggest problem is Humanity. And that problem will eventually solve itself.
Posted by Self-Banished on Oct. 16 2012,12:44 pm
^ aren't you just a ray of sunshine.I know the nuclear(nu-clee-er) problem with storage and the degradation of the plants is a major problem. We Americans just choose to "whistle past the graveyard" till something bad happens then blame it on the politician just happens to be in office at the time, don't think so? Try the I-35 bridge.
Posted by Liberal on Oct. 16 2012,5:20 pm
QUOTE
This is from a Congressional Briefing on ending Nuclear Power held last month. If you are able to dispute the information these people give, go ahead. At least listen to the information and THINK about things.
Why do you assume people don't know about this? Do you think we're all just too stupid to have read it, or just really gullible when it comes to the government?
The world just had the warmest September on record and most sane people will tell you that burning fossil fuels contributes to climate change, and you want us to get rid of nuclear power plants?
Posted by Self-Banished on Oct. 16 2012,5:59 pm
^ and the Brits just reported global warming being over 16 years ago. 
Posted by grassman on Oct. 16 2012,6:08 pm
Here's what we do see... we ship all of the wasted nuclear crap to Mars. We have to pollute the crap out of it anyway to make it inhabitable. Problem solved, send me a check. 
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 16 2012,9:42 pm
(Liberal @ Oct. 16 2012,5:20 pm)
QUOTE
QUOTE
This is from a Congressional Briefing on ending Nuclear Power held last month. If you are able to dispute the information these people give, go ahead. At least listen to the information and THINK about things.
Why do you assume people don't know about this? Do you think we're all just too stupid to have read it, or just really gullible when it comes to the government?
The world just had the warmest September on record and most sane people will tell you that burning fossil fuels contributes to climate change, and you want us to get rid of nuclear power plants?
What exactly did you read Liberal? You already "read" the videos? Maybe you found transcripts that I wasn't able to find.
QUOTE
Why do you assume people don't know about this? Do you think we're all just too stupid to have read it, or just really gullible when it comes to the government?
I assumed nobody had watched the videos, since nobody was talking about it. Maybe some people don't think things like this are as important as the economy or which president lies best, but I figured maybe some might be interested in this IF they already hadn't watched them. I could learn to try to argue about the economy and right vs. left so I can fit in better, but my heart just isn't in it.
QUOTE
The world just had the warmest September on record and most sane people will tell you that burning fossil fuels contributes to climate change, and you want us to get rid of nuclear power plants?
What exactly did you read? Not one person talked about relying on fossil fuels. They talked about alternative renewables. Wind, solar, anything that will help right now and in the future to make the world and people, cleaner, safer and healthier. They also explained how much cheaper it is than fossil and nuclear.
Oh, can't go to renewables, it's a scam. Costs too much. Won't supply me personally with enough electricity. Will ruin the economy. blahblahblahbittyblah.
Yes, some very sane people DO want to get rid of nuclear power plants, and if you watched the videos you would understand why.
Ya know, I heard that once upon a time, people used to sacrifice personal luxuries for the greater good. I heard people used to do crazyyyy things like ration, and sometimes do completely without. Heaven forbid anyone should even have to think about cutting down on power or fuel for awhile.
And Liberal, I really am sorry if I come across as if I think I am smarter or better than you or anyone else here. I definitely don't think I am. I am terrified of what things will be like for my kids and grandkids. Literally terrified. And I know that things have to change. And like SB said about American's whistling past the graveyard, I think most all of us know that we are in trouble, we just don't want to face it. Many things have to change in very big ways, and I am desperate that changes do happen. And the only way things will change, is if the majority of people realize it and are willing to help create those changes.
If people in the forum want me to shut the hell up and leave the forum I will. I'll go be desperate and pathetic somewhere else. Do a forum poll or ask people in private message.
Posted by Funkadelic Zombie Hunter on Oct. 16 2012,10:43 pm
I don't want you to go anywhere we may not agree but I am an insensitive S.O.B. I at least read the posts I am not as conspiratorial as you but you do make a few good points.I learned along time ago don't trust what is being shoveled because the mushroom principal is applied "you will be kept in the dark and feed manure" it's for your own good.
Some people are like sheep they need to be led around by a sheppard and are incapable of independent thought.
Posted by grassman on Oct. 17 2012,2:52 am
It is a scam to keep renewable energy down. I belong to a electric co-op. We get a monthly newsletter. One time they say that wind energy is not cost effective because the wind blows the most during daytime and usage is lower at that time. In a later letter they wrote that the wind blows during the night when usage is down. What is it? Smoke and mirrors to keep us on the ever dangling hook. Germany is WAY ahead of us.
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 17 2012,7:45 am
(grassman @ Oct. 17 2012,2:52 am)
QUOTE
It is a scam to keep renewable energy down. I belong to a electric co-op. We get a monthly newsletter. One time they say that wind energy is not cost effective because the wind blows the most during daytime and usage is lower at that time. In a later letter they wrote that the wind blows during the night when usage is down. What is it? Smoke and mirrors to keep us on the ever dangling hook. Germany is WAY ahead of us.
That is for sure.
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 20 2012,2:46 am
The Davis-Besse Nuclear Plant in Ohio has had a ridiculous amount of very big problems. In 2002, Davis-Besse's old nuclear reactor head
nearly burst. The lid was weakened by massive amounts of acid that had leaked from the reactor over several
years. The acid induced heavy corrosion on top of the head. Radioactive steam would have formed in a U.S.
nuclear containment vessel for the first time since the 1979 half-core meltdown of Three Mile Island Unit 2 in
Pennsylvania if Davis-Besse's lid had been breached. The only thing preventing that was a thin stainless steel
liner that had started to crack and bulge, records show.
Federal prosecutors later described the incident as one of the biggest cover-ups in U.S.
nuclear history. Two former Davis-Besse engineers were convicted of withholding information and put on
probation; the utility itself wound up paying a record $33.5 million in civil and criminal fines"; this represents the
"largest single fine ever proposed by the NRC."
The crisis at Davis-Besse is the most serious safety issue to face a commercial nuclear
power plant since Three Mile Island. The GAO report shows that the NRC was ill equipped, ill informed and far
too slow to react. The NRC's reaction to Davis-Besse was inadequate, irresponsible and left the public at grave
risk."
The casks were discovered to have been built below technical specifications: the aggregate used to
fabricate the casks' outer concrete walls essential for radiation shielding -- was poor quality, and the steel alloy
walls of the inner metallic canisters actually containing the irradiated nuclear fuel were ground too thin along the
weld lines, in violation of technical specifications. The Toledo Coalition for Safe Energy challenged the safety and
quality assurance of this proposal in 1994, but was overruled by NRC, which allowed loading of casks to begin in 1995. These faulty casks remain fully loaded with high-level radioactive waste onsite at Davis-Besse to this day, 15 years later.
High-level radioactive wastes are one of the most hazardous substances ever generated by humankind.
While electricity is but a fleeting byproduct, irradiated nuclear fuel will remain deadly and need to be isolated from the living environment "forevermore."
Without radiation shielding, it can deliver a lethal dose of gamma radiation in seconds or minutes, even decades after removal from the reactor. Alpha particle emitters, however, such as
Plutonium-239 -- a microscopic speck of which, if inhaled, could initiate lung cancer -- will remain hazardous for
hundreds of thousands of years. Other radioactive isotopes will remain deadly far longer Iodine-129, for
example, has a 157 million year hazardous persistence.
On July 31, 2006, FirstEnergy publicly admitted four "occurrences of inadvertent releases of radioactive
liquids that had the potential to reach groundwater," adding Davis-Besse to the growing list of 102 reactors in the U.S. that have leaked radioactivity into the environment since the early 1960s (and as the reactor ages, such leaks will become more likely).
< http://www.pdfdownload.org/pdf2htm...ges=yes >
Vermont Yankee Nuclear Power Plant has also had some major problems and near catastrophes. Most people in Vermont want it shut down. The Vermont Senate voted 26 to 4 against renewing the license. A federal judge knocked them down and said states have no right to regulate nuclear power. Their license was supposed to expire this year but it has been expanded until 2032.
Monticello and Prairie Island MN have also had many problems.
The Monticello reactor had it's license extended an extra 20 years. It is now allowed to run until 2030. Prairie Island's two reactors were also extended 20 more years and are now licensed to run until 2033 and 2034.
Most of the nuclear power plants in the US have had problems, most of them have had major problems and are having them more often because they are all hitting their age limit. They were only supposed to run for 40 years, they are all hitting that limit now, and they are all being permitted extensions. Of all the nuclear plants in the US, only two of them meet Federal Fire Regulations.- Even after all these years.
Nobody has any idea what to do with all the nuclear waste that is dangerous for(almost)ever. We just keep piling it up. Even the piles are causing major problems and dangers. Doesn't this seem like a stupid thing to keep going with?
P.S. This isn't me saying "neenerneener I know something you don't know". I put the info in here just in case anyone doesn't know about these things yet. For some reason the mainstream news doesn't go around talking about these big problems much. I'm scared to death for the future of all of our kids, and honesttoGod if we the people don't start being more active and vocal in what is happening, things are NOT going to change.
Posted by grassman on Oct. 20 2012,10:21 am
It is not convenient for us to know about it. It is better to stop wind energy because that is what is fed to the people by energy companies.
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 20 2012,11:05 am
(grassman @ Oct. 20 2012,10:21 am)
QUOTE
It is not convenient for us to know about it. It is better to stop wind energy because that is what is fed to the people by energy companies.
You are right, it is not convenient for them if we know about these things. I also understand these things are ungodly scary and many people would rather stick their heads in the sand than think about them.
I'm not one of those people, and for all of our childrens'/grandchildrens' sakes none of us should pretend there isn't a problem.
The thing I just can not comprehend is that I'm sure most of these people that know about these issues, and cover them up. Most of these people must have children and grandchildren of their own. So I really really don't understand. I find it mind boggling.
Posted by Liberal on Oct. 20 2012,1:46 pm
QUOTE
The thing I just can not comprehend is that I'm sure most of these people that know about these issues, and cover them up. Most of these people must have children and grandchildren of their own. So I really really don't understand. I find it mind boggling.
I can tell you why they don't care, it because it's all made up stories by conspiracy theorists that have nothing better to do than to yank the chains of their mentally unstable followers.
I mean how stupid/uneducated do you have to be to believe that the President can nullify the Constitution with executive orders?
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 20 2012,11:59 pm
(Liberal @ Oct. 20 2012,1:46 pm)
QUOTE
I can tell you why they don't care, it because it's all made up stories by conspiracy theorists that have nothing better to do than to yank the chains of their mentally unstable followers.
Really Liberal. All the information on the nuclear power plants can be found all on your own. Almost all of the sources in the Beyond Nuclear paper I linked to are government sources. NRC, U.S. General Accounting Office, Department of Energy, big list of sources at the end of their paper. So, how exactly can you call the nuclear power plant degradation conspiracy theory?
All the information I gave after their paper I found myself. All in completely "credible" news sites and government sites. Look for yourself.
Naww, it's alot easier to just call people names and pretend they are lying kooks isn't it.
Posted by Liberal on Oct. 21 2012,12:13 am
The only links you've posted was one for < http://coalitionagainstnukes.org/ > (I'm sure you can completely trust them, I'm sure they don't have an agenda at all)
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 21 2012,1:00 am
(Rosalind_Swenson @ Oct. 20 2012,2:46 am)
QUOTE
The Davis-Besse Nuclear Plant in Ohio has had a ridiculous amount of very big problems.
In 2002, Davis-Besse's old nuclear reactor head
nearly burst. The lid was weakened by massive amounts of acid that had leaked from the reactor over several
years. The acid induced heavy corrosion on top of the head. Radioactive steam would have formed in a U.S.
nuclear containment vessel for the first time since the 1979 half-core meltdown of Three Mile Island Unit 2 in
Pennsylvania if Davis-Besse's lid had been breached. The only thing preventing that was a thin stainless steel
liner that had started to crack and bulge, records show.
Federal prosecutors later described the incident as one of the biggest cover-ups in U.S.
nuclear history. Two former Davis-Besse engineers were convicted of withholding information and put on
probation; the utility itself wound up paying a record $33.5 million in civil and criminal fines"; this represents the
"largest single fine ever proposed by the NRC."
The crisis at Davis-Besse is the most serious safety issue to face a commercial nuclear
power plant since Three Mile Island. The GAO report shows that the NRC was ill equipped, ill informed and far
too slow to react. The NRC's reaction to Davis-Besse was inadequate, irresponsible and left the public at grave
risk."
The casks were discovered to have been built below technical specifications: the aggregate used to
fabricate the casks' outer concrete walls essential for radiation shielding -- was poor quality, and the steel alloy
walls of the inner metallic canisters actually containing the irradiated nuclear fuel were ground too thin along the
weld lines, in violation of technical specifications. The Toledo Coalition for Safe Energy challenged the safety and
quality assurance of this proposal in 1994, but was overruled by NRC, which allowed loading of casks to begin in 1995. These faulty casks remain fully loaded with high-level radioactive waste onsite at Davis-Besse to this day, 15 years later.
High-level radioactive wastes are one of the most hazardous substances ever generated by humankind.
While electricity is but a fleeting byproduct, irradiated nuclear fuel will remain deadly and need to be isolated from the living environment "forevermore."
Without radiation shielding, it can deliver a lethal dose of gamma radiation in seconds or minutes, even decades after removal from the reactor. Alpha particle emitters, however, such as
Plutonium-239 -- a microscopic speck of which, if inhaled, could initiate lung cancer -- will remain hazardous for
hundreds of thousands of years. Other radioactive isotopes will remain deadly far longer Iodine-129, for
example, has a 157 million year hazardous persistence.
On July 31, 2006, FirstEnergy publicly admitted four "occurrences of inadvertent releases of radioactive
liquids that had the potential to reach groundwater," adding Davis-Besse to the growing list of 102 reactors in the U.S. that have leaked radioactivity into the environment since the early 1960s (and as the reactor ages, such leaks will become more likely).
< http://www.pdfdownload.org/pdf2htm...ges=yes >
.
In 2002, Davis-Besse's old nuclear reactor head
nearly burst. The lid was weakened by massive amounts of acid that had leaked from the reactor over several
years. The acid induced heavy corrosion on top of the head. Radioactive steam would have formed in a U.S.
nuclear containment vessel for the first time since the 1979 half-core meltdown of Three Mile Island Unit 2 in
Pennsylvania if Davis-Besse's lid had been breached. The only thing preventing that was a thin stainless steel
liner that had started to crack and bulge, records show.
Federal prosecutors later described the incident as one of the biggest cover-ups in U.S.
nuclear history. Two former Davis-Besse engineers were convicted of withholding information and put on
probation; the utility itself wound up paying a record $33.5 million in civil and criminal fines"; this represents the
"largest single fine ever proposed by the NRC."
The crisis at Davis-Besse is the most serious safety issue to face a commercial nuclear
power plant since Three Mile Island. The GAO report shows that the NRC was ill equipped, ill informed and far
too slow to react. The NRC's reaction to Davis-Besse was inadequate, irresponsible and left the public at grave
risk."
The casks were discovered to have been built below technical specifications: the aggregate used to
fabricate the casks' outer concrete walls essential for radiation shielding -- was poor quality, and the steel alloy
walls of the inner metallic canisters actually containing the irradiated nuclear fuel were ground too thin along the
weld lines, in violation of technical specifications. The Toledo Coalition for Safe Energy challenged the safety and
quality assurance of this proposal in 1994, but was overruled by NRC, which allowed loading of casks to begin in 1995. These faulty casks remain fully loaded with high-level radioactive waste onsite at Davis-Besse to this day, 15 years later.
High-level radioactive wastes are one of the most hazardous substances ever generated by humankind.
While electricity is but a fleeting byproduct, irradiated nuclear fuel will remain deadly and need to be isolated from the living environment "forevermore."
Without radiation shielding, it can deliver a lethal dose of gamma radiation in seconds or minutes, even decades after removal from the reactor. Alpha particle emitters, however, such as
Plutonium-239 -- a microscopic speck of which, if inhaled, could initiate lung cancer -- will remain hazardous for
hundreds of thousands of years. Other radioactive isotopes will remain deadly far longer Iodine-129, for
example, has a 157 million year hazardous persistence.
On July 31, 2006, FirstEnergy publicly admitted four "occurrences of inadvertent releases of radioactive
liquids that had the potential to reach groundwater," adding Davis-Besse to the growing list of 102 reactors in the U.S. that have leaked radioactivity into the environment since the early 1960s (and as the reactor ages, such leaks will become more likely).
< http://www.pdfdownload.org/pdf2htm...ges=yes >
.
This one Liberal
And like I said in my last comment. Every other bit of information I gave I found in mainstream news or government websites themselves.
Posted by Liberal on Oct. 21 2012,1:51 am
That's a link to a PDF document storage site. The PDF is from a website beyondnuclear.com and the description of the site is in bold letters on the front page. "Working for a World free of Nuclear power and nuclear weapons". (Not sure, but I think they might have an agenda)QUOTE
And like I said in my last comment. Every other bit of information I gave I found in mainstream news or government websites themselves.
So why not post the links to these "mainstream news and government websites"?
Posted by busybee on Oct. 21 2012,2:12 am
Liberal · Posted on Oct. 21 2012,1:51 amQUOTE
That's a link to a PDF document storage site. The PDF is from a website beyondnuclear.com and the description of the site is in bold letters on the front page. "Working for a World free of Nuclear power and nuclear weapons". (Not sure, but I think they might have an agenda)
QUOTE
So why not post the links to these "mainstream news and government websites"?
Maybe because it's more fun to think it's "scaring" others into thinking and having a same belief about everything related to government as they do???
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 21 2012,2:15 am
(Liberal @ Oct. 21 2012,1:51 am)
QUOTE
That's a link to a PDF document storage site. The PDF is from a website beyondnuclear.com and the description of the site is in bold letters on the front page. "Working for a World free of Nuclear power and nuclear weapons". (Not sure, but I think they might have an agenda)
QUOTE
Almost all of the sources in the Beyond Nuclear paper I linked to are government sources. NRC, U.S. General Accounting Office, Department of Energy, big list of sources at the end of their paper.
You must have missed this part of my comment.
Posted by busybee on Oct. 21 2012,2:40 am
I could write something up and cite references too...that doesn't mean it's the truth and nothing but the truth, especially if you leave it up to others to figure out if it is or isn't...
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 21 2012,3:21 am
(Liberal @ Oct. 21 2012,1:51 am)
QUOTE
So why not post the links to these "mainstream news and government websites"?
I would rather people look up things for themselves sometimes. I think most people do look up what other people say. Usually people who look up info for themselves find out a lot of other things as well. But, since it must be too difficult for you:
Vermont Yankee problems:
two executives, asked by state regulators if tritium could leak from buried pipes as it had at other other plants, said it had no such pipes. In fact, an underground pipe was leaking tritium. Vermont Yankee has also had assorted mechanical problems over the years.
< http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2011...rs-fuel >
August 2007, a three story tall cooling tower at the Vermont Yankee nuclear power plant collapsed, goring a massive hole in the center of the structure and spewing asbestos, rotting wood, plastic panels, and thousands of gallons of water onto the bank of the Connecticut river. It later emerged that several employees had expressed concerns about the tower, and that, in the days before the collapse, others heard odd noises from within the structure. (This one gives a bigger list of problems)
< http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroo...a8fccd3 >
Vermont Senate vote to close Vermont Yankee:
MONTPELIER, Vt. — In an unusual state foray into nuclear regulation, the Vermont Senate voted 26 to 4 Wednesday to block operation of the Vermont Yankee nuclear plant after 2012, citing radioactive leaks, misstatements in testimony by plant officials and
< http://www.nytimes.com/2010...ll&_r=0 >
WASHINGTON — A federal judge on Thursday blocked Vermont from forcing the Vermont Yankee nuclear reactor to shut down when its license expires in March, saying that the state is trying to regulate nuclear safety, which only the federal government can do.
< http://www.nytimes.com/2012...es.html >
Vermont Yankee has been in commercial operation since 1972 and has had a license extension granted by the NRC to 2032.
< http://www.entergy-nuclear.com/plant_information/vermont_yankee.aspx >
Problems with storing waste with Monticello and Prairie Island plants:
< http://www.leg.state.mn.us/lrl/issues/issues.aspx?issue=prairieisland >
Federal officials are asking several nuclear power plants to check their facilities after a piece of equipment broke down at a power plant in central Minnesota. The plant, located northwest of the Twin Cites in Monticello, is still shut down.
< http://minnesota.publicradio.org/display...lloshut >
Authorities say a decrease in coolant levels for one of the plant's nuclear reactors indicated there may have be a leak.
< http://kaaltv.com/article/stories/S2526783.shtml?cat=10219 >
Gasket leak at Monticello, back up generator failed at Prairie Island:
< http://monticellotimes.com/2012...tuesday >
All 500 gallons of chlorine bleach in a tank escaped early Thursday at the Prairie Island nuclear plant in Red Wing, prompting an emergency response from Xcel Energy and delaying classes in two school districts.
< http://www.startribune.com/local/136729298.html?refer=y >
RED WING — The failure of two backup generators at the Prairie Island nuclear plant Tuesday has revived safety worries among the plant's neighbors, although regulators say the plant is safe.
< http://postbulletin.com/news/stories/display.php?id=1505422 >
So far, 66 of 104 reactors have been granted license renewals. Most of the 20-year extensions have been granted with scant public attention. And the NRC has yet to reject a single application to extend an original license.
< http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id...d-spans >
Xcel Energy filed a license renewal application with the federal Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC), seeking a 20-year license renewal for its Monticello facility. The single reactor at the Monticello plant was licensed until 2010. On November 8, 2006, the NRC granted the renewal, extending Monticello's operating license until September 8, 2030. On April 15, 2008, Xcel Energy submitted an application to the Nuclear Regulatory Commission seeking 20 year license extensions for Prairie Island's two reactors. The current licenses expired in 2013 and 2014. The NRC issued a final EIS related to the license extension in May 2011 and on June 27, 2011 the NRC renewed the operating licenses of both Prairie Island reactors. Reactor 1 is now licensed to operate until 2033 and reactor 2 until 2034.
< http://www.leg.state.mn.us/lrl/issues/issues.aspx?issue=prairieisland >
Only two U.S. nuclear sites are in compliance with federal fire regulations. How confident can we be that the Nuclear Regulatory Commission has things firmly in hand?
< http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroo...a8fccd3 >
The federal government promised almost 30 years ago to find a place to bury nuclear waste from power plants. It hasn't. So the waste is piling up at power plants around the country.
Now a federal court says the government must prove that this temporary solution is truly safe. The decision could help break the nuclear-waste logjam.
Most people agree that used nuclear fuel, which is highly radioactive, needs to be disposed of forever. But that's proving easier said than done.
< http://www.npr.org/2012...-logjam >
Nuclear power was by far the dumbest thing we have ever come up with.
Do you honestly think there is any way to safely store all of this waste for a couple hundred thousand years?
Way to plan for the future.
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 21 2012,3:25 am
(busybee @ Oct. 21 2012,2:40 am)
QUOTE
I could write something up and cite references too...that doesn't mean it's the truth and nothing but the truth, especially if you leave it up to others to figure out if it is or isn't...
True, but the sources that paper cites are the government agencies that are supposed to oversee and take care of the problems to keep us safe.
Plus, nobody has to be a rocket scientist to realize that having to store something as dangerous as nuclear waste for 200,000 years or more is more than ridiculous.
Posted by busybee on Oct. 21 2012,4:10 am
Ok...what do you want U.S. Citizens to do about your fears and concerns???
Posted by Grinning_Dragon on Oct. 22 2012,9:00 pm
So.. I hear that the What would a disaster relief agency like FEMA need with 2,500 brand new GLS armored fighting vehicles? According to the agency’s own mandate, as well as President Obama’s recent Executive Order, the answer is ‘population control’ during a time of Martial Law.
They’re labeled with the usual backward American flag and the title, ‘Homeland Security’. Below that and the DHS logo, it also reads, ‘Immigration & Customs Enforcement’. Joining those markings, the black vehicles with white lettering also display ‘POLICE/RESCUE’ on one side and ‘Special Response Team’ on the other.
This country is hemorrhaging money, and they choose to spend it on BS such as this. We do not need fema nor dhs nor tsa. Getting rid of these wastes of dept. would save quite a few billion a year.
Guess we can all thank bush for this decline into a police state and otardo for continuing it.
Posted by Botto 82 on Oct. 23 2012,3:02 am
^When the collective realizes how screwed it is, via its so-called leaders, well, that's what those are for - to insulate the screwers from the screwees.
Posted by busybee on Oct. 23 2012,3:50 am
Grinning_Dragon Posted on: Oct. 22 2012,9:00 pm
QUOTE
So.. I hear that the Reich-Stag er. DHS, has had a graduated class of 321 youths that will be used as FEMA's standing army per se. Does this country need another govt jackbooted armed morons? Isn't the national guard used for this? What is going to happen when the guard and these new brown shirts, start having a power struggle, during a crisis?
What would a disaster relief agency like FEMA need with 2,500 brand new GLS armored fighting vehicles? According to the agency’s own mandate, as well as President Obama’s recent Executive Order, the answer is ‘population control’ during a time of Martial Law.
They’re labeled with the usual backward American flag and the title, ‘Homeland Security’. Below that and the DHS logo, it also reads, ‘Immigration & Customs Enforcement’. Joining those markings, the black vehicles with white lettering also display ‘POLICE/RESCUE’ on one side and ‘Special Response Team’ on the other.
What would a disaster relief agency like FEMA need with 2,500 brand new GLS armored fighting vehicles? According to the agency’s own mandate, as well as President Obama’s recent Executive Order, the answer is ‘population control’ during a time of Martial Law.
They’re labeled with the usual backward American flag and the title, ‘Homeland Security’. Below that and the DHS logo, it also reads, ‘Immigration & Customs Enforcement’. Joining those markings, the black vehicles with white lettering also display ‘POLICE/RESCUE’ on one side and ‘Special Response Team’ on the other.
Nothing all too special about any of this...it always boils down to someone's brainy idea that makes them a living at the expense of other U.S. citizen's who know it's not going to "fix" the problem anyway.
To me this has little to do with politics and more to do with the instilled belief system that U.S. Citizens can somehow "control" everything that happens in this country or doesn't...
[QUOTE]This country is hemorrhaging money, and they choose to spend it on BS such as this. We do not need fema nor dhs nor tsa. Getting rid of these wastes of dept. would save quite a few billion a year.
Guess we can all thank bush for this decline into a police state and otardo for continuing it.[QUOTE]
Don't you ever find it confusing that the U.S. Government gets to decide whether or not it's own citizens have any rights to be protected from it's own citizen's terrorism, yet spends billions of dollars automatically assuming the biggest problem is other countries terrorists that need to be "fixed" instead?
It's extremely hypocritical...and continues to be a problem that both political parties pursue...
Posted by Grinning_Dragon on Oct. 23 2012,6:16 am
In all honesty, I didn't know anything about this until I over heard a group of Marines talking about this and making fun of it. They used a term in describing the graduates of dhs, and from what I gather it meant wanna be soldiers, they all laughed about it and called them other names and then wondered when the Marine Corps was gonna get some new toys that would be put to good use.
Posted by pepi-lapew on Oct. 24 2012,10:19 am
The marines can use the dhs army boys for cannon fodder to practice on. 
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 24 2012,12:38 pm
Those are some freakin huge vehicles GD. Why on earth would they need that many of those trucks? And like you said, with the money problems of the country, they must think they have a valid reason. Well said Botto.
I'm wondering about a couple of these partnerships between the US and other countries. If we can be called in to help partner countries with their problems, couldn't they also be called in to "help" our government out if there are problems? I'm thinking that would save the government the hassle of trying to force our military into going after American citizens.
he Partnership for Peace (PfP) is a programme of practical bilateral cooperation between individual Euro-Atlantic partner countries and NATO. It allows partners to build up an individual relationship with NATO, choosing their own priorities for cooperation.
Based on a commitment to the democratic principles that underpin the Alliance itself, the purpose of the Partnership for Peace is to increase stability, diminish threats to peace and build strengthened security relationships between individual Euro-Atlantic partners and NATO, as well as among partner countries.
< http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/topics_50349.htm >
and
The National Guard's 65-nation, 20-year-old State Partnership Program provides unique partnership capacity-building capabilities to combatant commanders and U.S. ambassadors through partnerships between U.S. states, territories and the District of Columbia and foreign countries.
The SPP supports U.S. national interests and security cooperation goals by engaging partner nations via military, socio-political and economic conduits at the local, state and national level.
< http://www.nationalguard.mil/features/spp/default.aspx >
___-
Does anyone know much about this "Garden Plot" thing? So far I haven't been able to find out much about it except from "kook" sites.
Air Force Garden Plot
4.1.1. The President is authorized by the Constitution
and laws of the United States to employ the Armed Forces
of the United States to suppress insurrections, rebellions,
and domestic violence under various conditions and circumstances.
Planning and preparedness by the Federal Government
and the Department of Defense for civil disturbances
are important due to the potential severity of the consequences
of such events for the Nation and the population.
< http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/dod/d302512p.txt >
Coast Guard Garden Plot:
1. PURPOSE. This manual instruction provides policy and guidance for the preparation and
execution of plans to support the Army in executing its Civil Disturbance Plan
(GARDEN PLOT) (reference (a)).
a. The department of the Army Civil Disturbance Plan (DA GARDEN PLOT), promulgated
in reference (a), is the governing publication for planning, deployment, employment, and
redeployment of federal military resources involved in countering domestic civil
disturbances. Coast Guard units may be placed within a Department of Defense (DOD)
task force under operational control of the designated task force commander in GARDEN
PLOT operations.
< http://www.pdfdownload.org/pdf2htm...ges=yes >
First one is from the Air Force website. Second is from the Coast Guard website.
Posted by Liberal on Oct. 25 2012,9:29 am
Funny how they have this on youtube, now all the conspiracy kooks will recognize it when the government comes to put them in re-education camps. Posted by Liberal on Oct. 25 2012,9:53 am
QUOTE
I'm wondering about a couple of these partnerships between the US and other countries. If we can be called in to help partner countries with their problems, couldn't they also be called in to "help" our government out if there are problems? I'm thinking that would save the government the hassle of trying to force our military into going after American citizens.
Do you really think some other country's force would do something heinous to a fellow American and our military would just stand down because of a paragraph in some obscure document? You must think our military is either really stupid, or evil.
Posted by Grinning_Dragon on Oct. 25 2012,10:52 am
(Liberal @ Oct. 25 2012,9:53 am)
QUOTE
QUOTE
I'm wondering about a couple of these partnerships between the US and other countries. If we can be called in to help partner countries with their problems, couldn't they also be called in to "help" our government out if there are problems? I'm thinking that would save the government the hassle of trying to force our military into going after American citizens.
Do you really think some other country's force would do something heinous to a fellow American and our military would just stand down because of a paragraph in some obscure document? You must think our military is either really stupid, or evil.
Gasp, I am going to have agree with the Lib here.
If you want to see a pissedOFF American military, put foreign boots on American soil and watch the blood of foreign soldiers flow in the streets of America.
I never thought of the
I can say though, those Marines were yucking it up about this, and said they would like to see how these wanna be's react in a fire-fight. GOD bless our Marine Corps.
Posted by grassman on Oct. 25 2012,10:54 am
I guess they left out one answer. Are they used against US citizens or against illegal aliens?
Posted by Grinning_Dragon on Oct. 25 2012,11:05 am
(grassman @ Oct. 25 2012,10:54 am)
QUOTE
I guess they left out one answer. Are they used against US citizens or against illegal aliens?
The group of Marines were talking about that as well grassman. And basically they said they would gun down everyone one of those dhs graduates if they tried to round up US citizens.
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 25 2012,11:26 am
(Liberal @ Oct. 25 2012,9:53 am)
QUOTE
Do you really think some other country's force would do something heinous to a fellow American and our military would just stand down because of a paragraph in some obscure document? You must think our military is either really stupid, or evil.
Obscure document?? The State Partnership Program has been running for 20 years.
QUOTE
The group of Marines were talking about that as well grassman. And basically they said they would gun down everyone one of those dhs graduates if they tried to round up US citizens.
I hope so. How many military people do we have at home on US bases? I can't find that info. Is there a set number that are always kept home?
QUOTE
and wondered why dhs needs anything like this, since we have the Guard.
Why did DHS call in mercenaries for Katrina?
Posted by Grinning_Dragon on Oct. 25 2012,11:41 am
NAS JRB New Orleans community has a population of 19,221 service members and their families from the Navy, Marines, Air Force, Army, Coast Guard, and Louisiana Air National Guard.Yes there is a minimum number of personnel that is kept on base.
One of the reasons fema hired mercs (at the insistence of then Gov Blanco and chocolate boy, both of which are fracking morons), was that a lot of the soldiers that were deployed down here, refused to carry out disarmament orders of the local citizens. I have asked around if there were any tensions between mercs and regulars, and only get spotty answers and nothing I can confirm or could say as factual. I have heard from locals that some of the mercs were completely out of line and no regard for rule of law or a persons Constitutional Right, some people fought back, most complied like sheep.
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 25 2012,11:58 am
According to those CBS and NPR articles, Homeland Security called in Blackwater right away. The mercs were in New Orleans before anyone else. Did they just figure the soldiers wouldn't do what was asked of them or had they already asked the soldiers? I thought it was the NOPD who was taking weapons.QUOTE
I have heard from locals that some of the mercs were completely out of line and no regard for rule of law or a persons Constitutional Right, some people fought back, most complied like sheep.
It sounds like they had no choice. Comply like sheep or get arrested.
Posted by Grinning_Dragon on Oct. 25 2012,12:22 pm
(Rosalind_Swenson @ Oct. 25 2012,11:58 am)
QUOTE
According to those CBS and NPR articles, Homeland Security called in Blackwater right away. The mercs were in New Orleans before anyone else. Did they just figure the soldiers wouldn't do what was asked of them or had they already asked the soldiers? I thought it was the NOPD who was taking weapons.
It sounds like they had no choice. Comply like sheep or get arrested.
QUOTE
I have heard from locals that some of the mercs were completely out of line and no regard for rule of law or a persons Constitutional Right, some people fought back, most complied like sheep.
It sounds like they had no choice. Comply like sheep or get arrested.
I think the article is misleading, national guard from neighboring states and local were called in well before any mercs were called in to help with rescues and help a very thin police force, the reason nopd was thin, was because most of the nopd officers were busy stealing, looting and shooting people. At the insistence of the nopd police cheif, he wanted the guard to also when going door to door, to disarm the locals in what he considered a safety issue for his
When these mercs and other officers came into Jefferson Parish, they were met with heavy resistance from both Jefferson Parish / Gretna police dept, and citizens that disarmament would not happen and orders were given by both police chiefs that any soldier or merc caught infringing upon a citizens Constitutional Rights were OK'd to use any means possible to stop the infringments, this same order was also intended for the local citizens to resist as well.
I don't live in Orleans trash Parish, I live in a Parish were the police chief trusts and depends upon the locals to rise up and become a citizen police / rescue force when the police are stretched thin. At anytime after a hurricane, looking at the crime map, all of the crimes or looting happen in Orleans and very few happen in the neighboring Parishes, HMMM, I wonder why? Because of an armed local citizenry, thats why.
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 25 2012,12:59 pm
Damn, it's amazing some of the things that went on down there and so little mention of it. Did the police chiefs who wouldn't allow weapons to be confiscated get in trouble?The last few years the media has been hyping a significant rise in big bad citizen militias. The Feds have made several raids on different groups. Maybe what the government says about them is true, maybe it's not. Most of them are peaceful and just being prepared to defend their families if something happens. I just wonder how that sort of thing would be handled if there is some sort of catastrophe and the government goes after groups like that.
Posted by Grinning_Dragon on Oct. 25 2012,1:25 pm
(Rosalind_Swenson @ Oct. 25 2012,12:59 pm)
QUOTE
Damn, it's amazing some of the things that went on down there and so little mention of it. Did the police chiefs who wouldn't allow weapons to be confiscated get in trouble?
The last few years the media has been hyping a significant rise in big bad citizen militias. The Feds have made several raids on different groups. Maybe what the government says about them is true, maybe it's not. Most of them are peaceful and just being prepared to defend their families if something happens. I just wonder how that sort of thing would be handled if there is some sort of catastrophe and the government goes after groups like that.
The last few years the media has been hyping a significant rise in big bad citizen militias. The Feds have made several raids on different groups. Maybe what the government says about them is true, maybe it's not. Most of them are peaceful and just being prepared to defend their families if something happens. I just wonder how that sort of thing would be handled if there is some sort of catastrophe and the government goes after groups like that.
The main police chief that made the federal govt back off was Harry Lee (RIP) he didn't take flack from anybody during that time, and threatened to deputize the entire Parish and arm the citizens if need be. And NO he or the other police chiefs never got into any trouble, they were threatened with being arrested, but they never backed down and called the govt bluff.
Most militia groups down here are a good group of guys and gals, and prepare for hurricanes and the aftermath, they all love their country. Most people would be surprised at some of those who are members, and are not your typical slack-jawed yokles the media portrays them to be. Lots of business men, lawyers, judges, police, former military, etc. They have no desire to overthrow the govt.
What people do not understand is, they are already in a militia. Citizens can be called up as part of the irregular militia as per Title 10 Sec. 311.
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 25 2012,2:30 pm
QUOTE
Most militia groups down here are a good group of guys and gals, and prepare for hurricanes and the aftermath, they all love their country. Most people would be surprised at some of those who are members, and are not your typical slack-jawed yokles the media portrays them to be. Lots of business men, lawyers, judges, police, former military, etc. They have no desire to overthrow the govt.
I agree. But our government lies it's face off. I'm not in any way defending David Koresh, but the government lied to get the National Guard in on that raid. I doubt they would hesitate to lie again. How can our military know if they are being told the truth or not?
They lied about Ruby Ridge. They lied about Oglala- an innocent man is still in prison for the Oglala incident. The government's response to that is pretty much "So what".
Ugh, I am not doing a very good job at explaining what I want to say. How would our soldiers know if they are being lied to and used, and how long would it take for it to become a "war" between militias and our military?
Posted by Liberal on Oct. 25 2012,11:13 pm
All members of the military take an oath to defend the Constitution and one of the first things you're taught is the difference between a lawful and unlawful order.Don't you get that most people joined the military to protect Americans? Why would they ever turn on them?
Posted by busybee on Oct. 26 2012,1:42 am
Liberal...I liked how you stated that "most" in the U.S. military have the best intentions to protect all U.S. Citizens. That's a very realistic and logical point of view to have.
Posted by Rosalind_Swenson on Oct. 26 2012,6:20 am
(Liberal @ Oct. 25 2012,11:13 pm)
QUOTE
All members of the military take an oath to defend the Constitution and one of the first things you're taught is the difference between a lawful and unlawful order.
Don't you get that most people joined the military to protect Americans? Why would they ever turn on them?
Don't you get that most people joined the military to protect Americans? Why would they ever turn on them?
I don't trust the government. Obviously. And now that more and more people are realizing how bad things are, it seems they are stopping at nothing to keep the status quo. All the crazy legislation that's been passed in the last year. All the reporters threatened and arrested the last few years. No regard for the constitution. They used the National Guard in Waco, and way back in Kent State. Hopefully, now, like you said, more of them will realize if their government is lying to them or not.
Posted by irisheyes on Oct. 26 2012,6:58 am
(Grinning_Dragon @ Oct. 25 2012,10:52 am)
QUOTE
I never thought of the Reich stag er, dhs graduate thing as a conspiracy, was just taken aback when I heard those Marines talking about it, and wondered why dhs needs anything like this, since we have the Guard.
The infowars lunacy has been brought up in numerous ways, whether it be FEMA or DHS, military, etc. The vehicle is certainly elaborate, but what would you expect for serving high-risk warrants or hostage type situations. It's a glorified bank truck, probably cost a fortune, but the guys going into those situations don't want to pull up in a Crown Victoria.
QUOTE
I can say though, those Marines were yucking it up about this, and said they would like to see how these wanna be's react in a fire-fight. GOD bless our Marine Corps.
I'm sure they were, sounds like a good ole fashioned chest pounding session. Did they take a break to use the tape measure?
Posted by Funkadelic Zombie Hunter on Oct. 26 2012,7:35 am
(busybee @ Oct. 26 2012,1:42 am)
QUOTE
Liberal...I liked how you stated that "most" in the U.S. military have the best intentions to protect all U.S. Citizens. That's a very realistic and logical point of view to have.
I have a little knowledge on this the most logical view point would be ALL would not follow or carry out an illegal order but sadly from the basic recruit to the four star there are some that will follow bad orders, some people are programed to follow nothing more they are the dangerous ones.
Just a note:
This affliction is not limited to the .mil exclusively there are examples in law enforcement other .gov depts AND the civilian population is rife with this affliction to the point they no longer can function without "guidance" it is my feeling that they are enslaving themselves without understanding the consequences.
Posted by Grinning_Dragon on Oct. 26 2012,8:29 am
(irisheyes @ Oct. 26 2012,6:58 am)
QUOTE
(Grinning_Dragon @ Oct. 25 2012,10:52 am)
QUOTE
I never thought of the Reich stag er, dhs graduate thing as a conspiracy, was just taken aback when I heard those Marines talking about it, and wondered why dhs needs anything like this, since we have the Guard.
The infowars lunacy has been brought up in numerous ways, whether it be FEMA or DHS, military, etc. The vehicle is certainly elaborate, but what would you expect for serving high-risk warrants or hostage type situations. It's a glorified bank truck, probably cost a fortune, but the guys going into those situations don't want to pull up in a Crown Victoria.
QUOTE
I can say though, those Marines were yucking it up about this, and said they would like to see how these wanna be's react in a fire-fight. GOD bless our Marine Corps.
I'm sure they were, sounds like a good ole fashioned chest pounding session. Did they take a break to use the tape measure?
So what you are saying is, that you agree that the United States need something like dhs and tsa and fema?
As I stated earlier, didn't know anything about this, until I over heard it, and looked it up online.
QUOTE
I'm sure they were, sounds like a good ole fashioned chest pounding session. Did they take a break to use the tape measure?
Is someone jealous that some Marines got use a tape measure and you would have to resort to a 0-1.0" micrometer?
Posted by grassman on Oct. 26 2012,10:10 am
That would work for girth but you would need a caliper for length.
Posted by Self-Banished on Oct. 26 2012,10:14 am
Maybe he's just plain dickless. P
Posted by grassman on Oct. 26 2012,9:52 pm
I was just being corrective, nothing against Irish. 