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minnow 
Group: Members
Posts: 2243
Joined: Aug. 2003
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Posted on: Feb. 13 2004,11:11 pm |
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Isn't it just perfect...we'll celebrate the national day of freedom by how many people we'll be able in incarcerate!
Ain't that America for you and me....Little pink houses for...
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| Post Number: 2
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MrTarzan
Group: Members
Posts: 564
Joined: Feb. 2004
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Posted on: Feb. 14 2004,12:05 am |
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I wonder if GEO with his statisical gathering prowness would feel like comparing Cop to population for this city and county compared to the norm in MN, or even the U.S. Is it just me or do we have a higher than normal ratio?  Why? Are we not losing population year after year? Why the big jail? Smoking ban preparation? 
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Be not simply good, be good for something-Henry David Thoreau
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| Post Number: 3
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minnow
Group: Members
Posts: 2243
Joined: Aug. 2003
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Posted on: Feb. 14 2004,2:08 am |
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When I think of how Geo's ranted on his own private drug war...then his war to save his own drugs, it reminds me of this famous quote---->
"In Germany they came first for the Communists and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist. Then they came for the Jews and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me--and by that time no one was left to speak up."
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| Post Number: 4
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MrTarzan
Group: Members
Posts: 564
Joined: Feb. 2004
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Posted on: Feb. 14 2004,9:30 am |
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I agree that there is no difference between Prohibition, which failed miserably and only made gangsters and dirty politicians (and dirty cops) rich, and the current attempt to control drugs. At least your favorite. I mean be real, how you going to ever stop a plant from being grown without totally removing all rights to have a private space in which you could grow it? It defies logic, and do we want to have even less rights than we have now. C'mon. Get real.  Under the disguise of a "war" on drugs we have seriously erroded our constitution by making law enforcement agencies a money making entity through their new confiscitory powers, of which even Readers Digest has run articles of the abuse of that.  People we all know have fought and died for freedom in real wars. Let's not give it away in a modern police state just because we prefer to drink. It scares me when I hear law enforcement officials talking about estimated income for the next year based on stuff they impound and sell. That to me is madness.
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Be not simply good, be good for something-Henry David Thoreau
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| Post Number: 5
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minnow
Group: Members
Posts: 2243
Joined: Aug. 2003
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Posted on: Feb. 14 2004,11:34 pm |
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Let's put drugs in perspective shall we...
Switzerland's Addiction Research Institute calls tobacco the number one killer addiction, responsible for 71 percent, or 4.9 million of the world's 7 million annual drug-related deaths. About 1.8 million deaths, or 26 percent, were attributed to the use of alcohol, while illicit drugs caused about 223,000, or 3 percent, of all worldwide drug-related deaths.
Hello...anyone home?
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| Post Number: 6
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MrTarzan
Group: Members
Posts: 564
Joined: Feb. 2004
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Posted on: Feb. 15 2004,2:02 pm |
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I believe that in a perfect world, noone would use mood altering drugs of any kind. But here in the real world, education and treatment are the only real tools we have to keep people from using. Incarceration does not really work. Moreover we spending our future stopping products that could be taxed on programs that don't change anything. Yesterday's bootlegger became today's big employer and we even had the son of one become a great President. Why are we throwing millions of people in jail because they want to use something that others don't? It won't stop it. It enriches criminals and law enforcement, and impovershes the rest of us with more and more taxes.
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Be not simply good, be good for something-Henry David Thoreau
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| Post Number: 7
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minnow
Group: Members
Posts: 2243
Joined: Aug. 2003
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Posted on: Feb. 15 2004,2:25 pm |
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I believe that in a perfect world, noone would use mood altering drugs of any kind. ---->Why?
But here in the real world, education and treatment are the only real tools we have to keep people from using---->Using what? What if we invented a drug that not only made you live longer and made you healthier, but also gave you a buzz as well? What's wrong with that? The overwhelming majority of americans are on drugs at any one time.
Why is it inherently bad to use mood altering drugs?
I swear, sometimes I really feel like packing up and heading to Europe where I can gt away from insane hypocrites like Geo. Here he wants kids who try meth even once to get a life sentence, no parole. Yet at the same time wants the worlds deadliest adn most additive drug legal in public spaces.
When a rational person thinks about it, well, it's just insane.
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| Post Number: 8
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MrTarzan
Group: Members
Posts: 564
Joined: Feb. 2004
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Posted on: Feb. 15 2004,3:48 pm |
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I guess I feel the way that I do because I get a rush naturally on life. I don't feel a need to stay high on anything. Yes if they had a drug with no harmful side effects that would help me live longer and feel great, like many I would probably use it for the long life part. I usually feel great just breathing naturally. I did not say it was inherently bad. Humans have done it without fear of arrest for most of history. Only now has it become wrong. Even the history channel aired a show about the war on pot that showed it was originally banded only because of illegal immigrants bringing it over and becoming wealthy.
I also do not dispute that most Americans, as most of the world use something all the time. It will probably never change. I did not mean to imply that we should be keeping them for using (I believe in freedom of choice) but simply that education so they can make informed descisions is better than jail. I believe jails should be limited to locking up those that would physically harm others or their property, instead of letting them out to lock up users and their suppliers (who are no different then bootleggers were) letting the strong arm criminals like the ones that robbed the dominos man go free on work release because of over crowding. I agree that it is a little insane ;)
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Be not simply good, be good for something-Henry David Thoreau
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| Post Number: 9
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minnow
Group: Members
Posts: 2243
Joined: Aug. 2003
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Posted on: Feb. 15 2004,4:07 pm |
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We were just sold...no forced a $40,000,000 Jail and Harig has already blew his annual budget already after month 2. All told we'll spend $60 million at just the LOCAL level. Much more at the state and federal level.
And do you remember why? Drugs and meth...
Even though those offenders go to prison and not county jails.
Drugs are being harvested as a way to justify outrageous government spending. It's either do it for "the children" or do it to stop drugs. It's all BS.
And I'm the BS snifter. 
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| Post Number: 10
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Truth
Group: Members
Posts: 552
Joined: Feb. 2004
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Posted on: Apr. 13 2004,3:42 am |
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You're the B.S. something.
If illict drugs only account for 3% of those eliminated from the earth per year than we should ban them as an effective population control.
Either way they suck. Face it Mini.
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The best weapon against an enemy is another enemy.
Nietzsche
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